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Hi Mama,

we brought our ad home at age 13 months and at age 6 she was dx ADHD and also ODD. As your AS's behaviour is apparent in two settings (home and school) I would pursue the ADHD route. For a dx of adhd the behaviour has to be present both at home and school. I appreciate that you are worried that his behaviour could be due to trauma rather than ADHD and yes the behavioural symptoms do mirror each other. However, ADHD is due to the brain waves in the frontal lobes being too slow. When my ad was dx the doctor did a scan of her brain (they put a cap on her head and then attached electrodes to it) and it was clear to see that her brain waves were indeed too slow. we started on meds straight away and to be honest they have been a godsend although they are not a cure. the meds speed up the brain waves so that she can actually control her behaviour and calm down. it has also enabled her to take advantage of school and finally start to learn. So my advice would be to go and see your GP and get a referral, although be careful with Cahms, as many on the old boards reported how Cahms put everything to do with adopted children down to attachment / trauma and refused to consider anything else. We got a private dx of ADHD for our ad - did this because I did not want to go to cahms and also because i wanted a quick dx and access to the meds as our ad's behaviour was getting worse and becoming unbearable at home.

Just to add, once we had our ad on the meds it became clear, over a number of years, that the adhd was actually masking other problems. she now also has dx's for dyslexia, dyspraxia and ASD. I think there is also attachment problems in the mix as well - i think this is par for the course with adopted children especially once they become fully aware of what it means to be adopted.

best wishes xx

Our child is not yet at the age where they can diagnose ADHD but they could check for ODD. We found that there is a tendency by the school to rush to a label and tbh innocently looking to get the additional funding. If we need a GP to run the tests, we will and definitely sounds like a good thing from what 'windfalls' says around unmasking other problems. We found though there are lots of emotional and behavioral challenges. Most seem to be down to our child having never learned things and if it was taught it was attached to trauma in some way or another. There is key difference with your situation, our child was already nearly 4 years when coming to live with us. We have experienced the same behaviour that you have and we've been told it has a lot to do with the freedom experienced at christmas time and also the common pushing boundaries that adopted children do over the years as they grow. Before we even think of GP, we are working with the school to change their approach which have become less effective in most cases - things like moving our child to an office to calm down. At first it helped our child adjust and reflect, and was a safe environment for all, but now our child sees it as a reward for bad behaviour. Kids are so clever and grow so fast it is hard to keep up with them sometimes. If the school have secured all the funding possible and have an educational psychologist reporting on new ideas etc, I would push hard to get all that done. What's the harm in just having a chat with your GP at the same time?!? Also, I would talk with the post-adoption support team to see if there are any courses or people that can help guide you as well.

Hi Mama and Orion,

I think that in the vast majority of cases behaviour due to attachment/trauma co-exist along with ADHD and/or other conditions. Don't forget there are reasons why these children find themselves in care, there are reasons why birth parents lead chaotic lives, reasons why birth parents are unable to put their children's needs before their own and in the vast majority of cases this is due to mental health problems which often are undiagnosed in birth parents eg ADHD, ODD, conduct/personality disorders, ASD, Bi-polar etc.

Also remember that if the underlying cause of a child's behaviour is ADHD, then until that is addressed all the therapy in the world to help with attachment/trauma will not make any difference because the child will not be able to concentrate long enough to access it.

Please do not spend years and years thinking that your child's behaviour is all down to attachment/trauma and thus dealing with appalling and challenging behaviour which never ever gets any better. Please also consider other co-existing possibilities. As i mentioned earlier, the adhd meds have made a huge difference to our ad and they also deal with the ODD.

parenting our children is really tough and can and does have a massive impact on the rest of the family. Please don't make it even more difficult for your children and yourselves. Please do keep an open mind.

best wishes xx

forgot to add - all of the above conditions all have a genetic element - if birth parents have it - whether diagnosed or not - strong likelihood that they will have passed them on to the children.

Just really wanted to add to what Windfalls is saying - my AD has severe ADHD and I knew she did from a very young age (I didn’t before but read a lot about it) - no one would assess her because she had a non accidental head injury so everything was put down to that - even at school which was a special school a couple of members of staff had said to her when she asked they thought she had ADHD but no one thought to discuss it with me. When she was at college she was groomed and sexually assaulted and then got herself into risky situations so many times - as adult mental health would still not assess I finally went privately and she was put on medication. It made a huge difference to her and I wish I had done it years before - as Windfalls says you can then begin to address the other issues - she is complex and also has borderline learning difficulties, is dyslexic, has speech and language issues, a social communication disorder and of course attachment issues together with the effects of early trauma - which all interact. The medication curbs the impulse control and makes it manageable and also helps her to focus enough to learn. Please - if people are suggesting you get your child assessed take them up on that. If it’s not ADHD you can then rule that out and anyway you will learn something from the assessment.

Hello, my AC are now young adults but at length were dx with several things. My son had ADD- attention deficit disorder and our AD with ADHD. They both have Autistic spectrum issues- our son Aspergers and our AD has atypical autism. I suspect that birth family genetic inheritance has a lot to do with their complexities but the dreadful losses, repeated trauma and very awful early life experiences have landed on top.

I tend to think that children placed under two are still often presented to adopters as having no issues or a bland ‘we can’t predict the future’ type catch all’s when frankly social care should know better.

The catastrophic losses of a parent, every sight smell, sound associated with them suddenly wiped out of your life, then again into and out of fc at least once is really important to recognise that impact. Often children experience an attempted reunion and when that fails the child faces that loss again. Ontop of that you’ve got often generational neglect abuse and chaotic living plus the physical harm... it is a huge list when you look at it and it is very, very clear that they body keeps the score’ even when a child cannot necessarily remember.

I wonder if you went back to post adoption for some ASF support and took him to see stepping stones in Cardiff or family futures in London or Chrysallis associates in Sheffield or catchpoint in Bristol (I know the catchpoint best and they’d do a very good therapeutic needs assessment for a very good rate) if they could give some support to school.

It is a very specialist area actually. I would approach CAMHS but with caution. They can be great (ours were) but equally can be utterly dreadful.

Has he been seen by an educational psychologist at school? Do you know if he had a proper ‘strange situation test’ style attachment assessment?

I would just like to reassure you that yes your child is pretty normal, within the realms of a child who has experienced big repeated trauma with a less than idea set of early circumstances.

There is a great deal school can do. Maybe take a look at ‘inside I’m hurting’ by Louise bomber. Also look at some of this- I found it very helpful here.

https://www.acesconnection.com/g/aces-in-education/clip/calmer-classrooms-a-guide-to-working-with-traumatised-children-pdf

I would agree with what others have said. Our dd was diagnosed with ADHD and anxiety disorder at 15 and I am pretty sure there is a bit of ASD though no diagnosis. We were very sure she had ADHD when she came to us at 7 but the behaviours have to be seen in two places usually school and home, and school didn’t acknowledge her difficulties even though to us they were very obvious in the way she behaved at school. Everything was blamed on attachment and early trauma; which although very significant were not the only things going on. As others have said if you can possibly afford it have a private assessment as CAHMs have long waiting lists in many areas. Round here it is about a year. Download the characteristics of ADHD and if you feel they match some of the difficulties show it to school to get them on board. The medication made a lot of difference to our dd she is able to concentrate much better and persevere with tasks and it helps with her impulsive behaviour. It has also helped her to engage better in therapy which she couldn’t do before. We really wished we had pushed harder when she was younger.

http://come-over.to/FAS/PDF/OverlappingCharacteristics.pdf

This is quite a dated list now - first saw it before either of my younger two were diagnosed - but still worth a look.

In reality it’s highly likely that there’s more than one thing in the mix - whether that’s ASD, adhd, fasd, genetic mental health issues ... on top of trauma etc.

My younger two are both dx autistic, not birth sibs. When you look back over birth family history you can see it ... except that the (lazy) assumption by profs was always ... ooh attachment! Nope! As it happens with the right diagnoses my kids are doing well - all three - so be open minded. And insist that profs involved are equally so.

Going back to Rosiebo’s suggestion of a private assessment - it took about a week for ours from making enquiries to getting appointment - then a further ten days or so for the report - we needed to provide reports to him on the day which he then went through too and added

Our private assessment was also very quick. The psychiatrist said he saw lots of signs just watching her in our first appointment. Our longest wait was for school to complete forms ( secondary school) this time. ) we chose teachers we knew saw her difficulties and they filled in the forms , but the whole process was only a few weeks.