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I'm trying to imagine what I would do if it was my girl. I guess I'd be trying to find out what's behind it - is it just self esteem, is it more than that - so I'd start by gently talking (which I'm sure you have done!) I'd be trying to figure out what is it about college or a job that worries her? (I'd assume it was a fear based thing). Our girl is 16 at the moment, but we very much think of her as young, so it's possible your boy is is emotionally younger too - could it be that the grown up world might just all be too big and scary for him and he can't admit it? I know it is for our girl, and somehow she is able to communicate that to us (as a way of hoping we'll help her to not deal with it!) I think it can be harder for boys. I'd take her out - shopping, lunch, cinema - show her a good time to try and shake her out of herself, just as a wee start. And I'd probably try and take her to the GP because I'd be concerned that she was depressed. But that's me knowing my girl - your boy might be quite a different kettle of fish, but maybe there's something of use in all of that muddle I just wrote! xx

I sent a PM

I give you permission to do absolutely nothing, He’s 18 so I think it’s pretty much impossible for you to change him. So. Change what you’re doing. Stop. By all means give info about the princes trust and if he shows any interest I know you’ll be in like flinn and encouraging him. The only person you can change is you so give that a go- take up belly dancing or trampoline, clog painting or learning greed. Whatever you fancy .

:-) Peartree I like your ideas. Personally I need to unlearn greed (go to Weightwatchers perhaps?) :-) Seriously though you're right it is impossible to change someone else. If only Pluto was here. She would have some ideas like hose him down every morning or stop feeding him :-) I miss Pluto!

Pluto would sort him out!

But apart from that - there isn’t really much you can do other than responding to the times you see a glimmer of his old self - but not using that as an opportunity to get your message across (nag?) but rather to rebuild your relationship - focus on that I think. Try and ignore the rest - and as advised above find things to distract you / relieve the stress. Bryan Post would be a good one to read for this I think and he’s done a lot of work with teens

Larsti lol meant to be learning GREEK !

Yes I thought so but couldn't resist my little joke. Got to get your amusement where you can eh Peartree?? :-)

A Freudian slip maybe? (It’s easier to learn Greed than Greek I think!) (and what is clog painting - out of interest?)

Clogs I presume these are wooden Dutch shoes, which once painted up nicely, can then be used to throw at anyone who irks you too much. Could be considered a sport, so definitely part of a rigorous self-care programme, which we are always encouraged to follow to keep up our spirits.

Just wondering where he gets his money from? Increasing or decreasing it might be a motivation?? It's what makes me get up on a Monday, anyway. Seriously - could he be depressed? Trying to get more connected with him would be what I'd try - spend time with him, offer an outing etc? If he's like my 18 yo, he would at first bluster and refuse, then expect me to have arranged X (the outing or whatever) already.

Money is a big motivator here too. But re depression. I became aware that my 15 yr old was lying in the dark for hours with his iPad. ( if you use an iPad you will be aware that the glare from an overhead light causes glare on the screen , making it difficult to see) I started wondering if the too much screen time and lying in the dark, were affecting his brain hormones in some way. Expirement on this ( by limiting access to iPad) has only been running 3 days so much too early to tell. You can block his internet access on your router by identifying his device(s) on the routers login screen and setting a time limit. He gets some back after doing something useful re jobs or college. Don't give him any money, if he is claiming it from dhss then it will stop if he doesn't do enough job hunting.

Depression is a real possibility but he would have to admit there was a problem and need to be able to go to the GP himself to get help

Hi Lalaland - sorry to hear about your son and his troubles. FWIW I think these are very tough times to be a young adult. My own children are slightly younger (eldest 16 and at college) but I know several friends with non-adopted older children, and even those who have done well academically and have the prospect of university are struggling with motivation. But if you've got A levels in the bag it is socially accepted to take a "gap year" - much tougher for our kids who don't necessarily have the positive self-esteem of a very successful education before hand, and who are under pressure it feels to get into the "real world" much more quickly than kids going via university. Coming at it from that perspective I would be coming at this from a perspective of sympathy and support, recognising that he is probably very afraid right now, and needs you more than ever. I'd also encourage you to "think younger" and not be afraid to try to put some boundaries in - you never know, he may quietly welcome them (I know my daughter does, although recognise there's a difference between 16 and 18. But, for example, I think it is fair for you to say during the week at least you'd like him home by 10.30 or 11.00 or whatever time because you worry when he's not home, and ask that if he's going to be later than that he texts you. By doing this you are showing that you care (and it may help his sleep patterns.) Then you need to be rebuilding his confidence as others have suggested. Don't worry about making any long term plans, just focus on a few simple things that get him out of the house and give you a bit of contact. Give him a sense of being useful. I don't know how much you're around during the day/week or what his interests are, but would suggest you tell him you need his help with e.g. the weekly shop, getting things ready for christmas, that you'd like him to help you make the dinner once a week. And that could include treats too - a lunch out, a walk/run, cinema. Try to get a routine going that involves you spending some low key time together and him doing things independently. The bit I think I'd struggle with is rushing into big questions too quickly, so I'd be inclined to say to yourself (and your son too explicitly if it helps) that you're not even going to start talking or thinking about what next for a few weeks e.g. til after Christmas, or February or whatever.. Be kind to yourself and each other. LB x

Thank you everyone for your comments, much appreciated. Also nice to know that we are not on our own here!

can I just say that Pluto has a very particular approach to life, it doesnt suit everyone

Agreed Serrakunda! Pluto's approach seems to work for her sons. They know where they are. But I've never been as strict myself. Good points from little bear. I have 2 BCs who have struggled with depression, motivation and sleep patterns. In one case short lived but the other has had more long term problems.

Same for me re Pluto’s approach - I meant it tongue in cheek! Not something that would work for me - or I could do

I haven't been on here for a while - struggling with day to day living to be honest (three adopted children all placed with us as babies, now 16, 19 and 21 years old). Our 16 year old is wonderful; a few problems with our 19 year old just surfacing - she has discovered that she "craves" alcohol which is rather worrying; but our 21 year old is the real problem and has been since he was 15 years old. Similar problem to you lalaland- dropped out of school, didn't take GCSEs, then took English iGCSE and got a D after just a few lessons with me! He isn't daft and is capable of so much more. But we never put pressure on. He went off to college to study Dance when he was 16 and got a Distinction in his BTEC. Since then he has been to three more colleges and dropped out each time. Every year he states he wants to join a new course the following September and then sits around doing nothing - or lies in bed all day. Won't work, won't help around the house, swears and criticises us. His younger sisters (particularly the 19 year old) disappear when he kicks off. I really now think it is a control issue - he knows we want him to get up and do something with his life, so he doesn't. By the way, we give him no money. He received PIP for anxiety but that is stopping. Says he won't pay rent and won't sign on. I think the advice to "Stop" is sensible. You have to concentrate on yourself once they get to a certain age. Be there for them if they are being respectful and want advice/help, but otherwise absent yourself. This is so, so hard for us to put into action - both my husband and myself work part-time from home. But the hardest thing to take is the verbal abuse and criticism. I just can't throw him out onto the streets - and that would take police involvement because he would never leave by his own choice. He has no friends to stay with now having lied to so many of them. He really is making our lives miserable, but we have had no support from Post Adoption, Social Services etc. Post Adoption never return our calls or emails, and Social Services took a month to come back to us and even then could only refer us to websites! Sorry to unburden like this, but we are desperate. It is some comfort to see that we are not alone in this, but I hope for others that their situation is not as awful as ours.