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Hi potter638,

clubs eh? From your story I understand you've been involved with Scouting yourself for several years. From that period, do you know any of the people involved in the Scouts group your son is attending? I would ask them what his poor behaviour was. Were you made aware after the first time or did you only hear after the second time when he was excluded? If so, why? Since he isn't the only scout excluded, was the poor behaviour a group thing? What made him then stand out that you have to attend whereas other parents do not? Did he lead the group? Was he the one caught in the act? You don't have to post the answers here, it's none of our business, but you need to know every detail. Letting them explain what happened, and why they decided on exclusion, verbally in detail to you also gives them time to reflect upon the whole business and it shows your interested in your child.

My middle son also had trouble in clubs (sports, not Scouts) and I'm always there too. I wasn't asked, but between the lines it was clear they liked me to be there (this is about 4 years ago now). It's going better now and perhaps I needn't be there, I'm usually just pottering about with the little one, so I'm there, but not really involved. My son also has extra help in school, so for us it's not just in clubs.

It's tricky, because you don't want them excluded (at all, but definitely not permanently) and you do have to support him in achieving that. I've also been a scout leader (a lifetime ago) and that just grew from being a member to being a leader and we in our late teens/early twenties would not have had a clue about adoptive children. We did have one (internationally) adopted child in the Explorers though, but she did not have any behavioural issues that I recall. I'm saying this because although we want teachers and club leaders to be empathic towards our children, it's not so easy. Until I adopted and lived this, I didn't have a clue either and even now, it is not easy day in day out to deal with (some of) our children, as I'm sure you know too.

I would speak to the Scout leaders to get to the bottom of what happened, who did what and take it from there. Obviously something happened that you'll need to speak to your son about and only you will know how and when to do that. As I'm sure you will, also fight his corner with the Scout leaders, but don't make it adversarial. At the end of the day, (I think) you want him to be in Scouts because (I think) he wants to be in Scouts. Your son also needs to understand that if he wants to be free of you, he needs to make sure he doesn't get into big trouble. It may also be that he deep down does not want to be free of you and would like you there.

Good luck. I know it's something you don't need and it's not easy.

My experience of scouts with my son was not a positive one. We tried two different troops - the first was okay for a while but not terribly well managed - lots of very boisterous behaviour which my son struggled with.

Second group was quieter, Scout leader appeared to listen - my son was by then dx adhd and asd - and seemed to take everything on board. Then one Sunday he turned up at the house, out of the blue, to tell me that my son was excluded from a trip he successfully managed with the previous troop. No debate. Just we’re not taking him. He was the only one.

My son was distraught. There was no understanding despite the inclusive blurb on their website. They just didn’t want to know.

I made a formal complaint and escalated it. Scout leaders had to undergo training but it was too late for my son. There was no way he was going back.

I know we’re not the only ones to have had similar experiences.

No real answers as my boy wouldn’t return. But definitely I didn’t find them at all inclusive.

No experience of scouts but mine did go to woodcraft folk for a short while.

Going on from Papito’s post I would ask for a face to face meeting - at a time when the leader is not distracted by needing to do other things - and go though all the questions raised above so you have as much information as you can. Then I would explain your sons behaviour / needs in as simple a way as possible - maybe suggest some simple adaptations / strategies if there are any you think of which might help. If they still want you to be there - view this as a positive move to ensure your child’s safety and see if you can agree a time when this could be reviewed . Think about if there is a way you could be there (available) without intruding on your sons space - such as having s coffee nearby or sitting in the car and reading - it might give you a bit of peace too. As stated above the leaders have very little training or experience and it is all basic stuff unless they have personal experience themselves which is useful

They may well need some extra help. Attachment disorder brings difficulties in group activities. Activities carry different risks, and failing to manage a group where a few children have difficulties with self-regulation can easily result in things spiralling. My guess would be that, seeing you as parent to a child with attachment difficulties, they are in awe of your ability to help your child regulate. It's quite a rare and valuable ability, and not something that can be learnt overnight. Maybe the other parents don't have that ability? I would at least work with the leaders to help put support in place. It may be that you ARE the only pair of safe hands. Or you may be able to brainstorm alternative options such as a "buddy" or an extra volunteer or a support worker from a charitable organisation or another parent.

Just thought I’d stop by and comment on this one. My son attended cubs and initially scouts with some success. Admittedly, OH was at cubs, but even when he went up to scouts things were fine at first. He was never excluded from scouts, but his behaviour went downhill there. I think it may have been a combination of factors – older scouts who were a sensible influence moving on, sillier younger scouts moving up, a clash of personality with a young leader, school peers telling him scouts was boring, the stars not aligning…..who knows…. Anyway, he told me he didn’t want to go anymore, and he persevered till the end of the term (I had paid for that) and then stopped attending. His behaviour had been on the slide and OH told me that he was only attending as he was a cub leader, otherwise he would probably been told to leave. It seemed sad after so many years of enjoyment that it ended that way.

Potter638, I totally empathise with “not taking attachment disorder into account”. There is another child with quite obvious difficulties attending the cubs my son used to go to. In this case, the child has learning disabilities that mean there is an extra person with them all the time, helping them to access the activities. This child regularly gets given awards for “trying hard” and “joining in”, even though this wouldn’t at all be possible without the help they get. And yet, a child with attachment difficulties is just “misbehaving”….. Certainly I find with my son it is a case of mainly just not letting things escalate. Spotting the problem before it gets out of hand.

I think that if your son is still keen to go, perhaps you could manage to arrange something, but worth having a chat with the leaders to see what can be done. Perhaps an extra adult to make sure things don’t escalate could be helpful, does it have to be you? Think Papito makes a good point that perhaps your son actually would like you to be there. It’s always possible to be in the background, not even in the same room and yet still a reassuring presence.