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There are several adopters I know who have this...the behaviour of the older child can affect the younger ones - hopefully someone will be along soon who can advise...

I have two adopted children. My older has adhd and shows signs of early truama. My younger AS doesnt have these issues, but like you say he does copy behaviour but only at hone. He is perfectly behaved at school. They can be extremely silly together at home and can often end up hurting one another. Starting school has really helped my AS. He has positive role models there and has learnt a lot through that. He is so much calmer as a result since starting at school, understands boundaries better (although can still get unregulated around his sister, but he is only 7. ) I also separate the children and encourage them to do different activities. So for example this Easter, they will only spend 50 per cent of the holiday together. My husband is taking my son camping for a week and I will have special time with my daughter that week. Both of them are much calmer on their own and it gives them and us a break. You mention therapy. Have you looked into sensory integration therapy? This helped my ad enormously when she was about 6, much more so than any other therapy she has done. You can get funding for this through the Asf. You also mention possible adhd. Personally I would be really pushing for an assessment. Medication can make an enormous difference, more so I think than any type of therapy, but that’s just my personal experience. Having said that I know a lot of parents of children with adhd, some of them adopted, and they all swear by the medication. Take care x

Hello. My ac were 10 and 11 when little pip was born. She is our bc. I’m sorry to say that bringing her up with the AC has caused some troubles for her. Settling at night continues to be an issue. This is because her older adopted sister wouldn’t leave her alone. In the end we had a pressure alarm in Pips cot so we could hear if she was being moved. When pip got to about 18mths/2 things really did become impossible at home. Blossom was pretty wildly violent at times. When you have a tiny one they can’t escape. So for the first two years Pip didn’t leave me or mrPT. Even taking her into the toilet with us. Blossom would enact things on the baby in a sort of trancelike state. Part of severe dissociation. In the end there were a couple of serious incidents and one major one which meant absolutely blossom and pip couldn’t live together. It broke my heart into bits. But I just knew things couldn’t carry on as they were. Anyway. When blossom moved, she moved into a therapeutic community. This was a big fight to obtain. But we felt blossom deserved a chance. Our adopted son started to flourish and became much more ‘atttached’ and family became increasingly important for him. The 2 AC have a trauma bond and although it was a horrible time, he really did benefit from her moving. So for just over 5 years with blossom we did parenting from a distance. This meant we visited regularly and took her out. My family also visited. Blossom had her own sw and iro and I was just her mum. This is like other people who have lots of money and send their kids boarding. They are sad to see them go. But feel assured it really is their best chance at life if they go. Anyway. Pip is now 11 and neither of the AC live at home. Partridge is 24 and generally ticking along. His major issues continue to be lying and poor relationships. Blossom sadly we have no contact with but sometimes hear via the grapevine what’s what. Partridge has a job and now a first car. But you know messy in other ways. Pip. Pip is also ok. She has anxiety and finds disconnection from us especially at nights very hard. But she is learning to use strategies to help her. She’s a bubbly, kind, characterful child who loves singing and dancing and drama. So there you go. Partridge and pip lived together with us until partridge moved out from here aged 21. We see him about once a month and he and Pip live eachother. Blossom and Partridge have no relationship. I know a few parents like us. I’ve noticed I found it tricky becoming a ‘bio mother’ as I rather liked being an adoptive parent. That took some swallowing! I would say enjoy your children, that includes to say enjoy that littlest one. It’s easy to put all the needs of the AC first often. My parents used to have my AC on a Friday after school for tea. This gave mrPT and me some time with Pip to get to know her a bit. This has continued with partridge as he still visits his grandparents often

Thank you freddie2, that was really helpful to hear. Your situation sounds similar to ours and it's helpful to hear that other families have to divide the children in order to cope and survive. Both of our children are different when they are on their own with one of us and it means we can actually enjoy them rather than just barely coping. Yes, going to his preschool has really helped the LO, and he is really looking forward to school - I think that will really help him, We are going to be having therapy with Integrate Families who specialise in trauma and dissociation in adoption and I think they will also look at sensory issues. Yes, we are going through an ADHD assessment with CAMHS - but they have told us it will take 10 months before we get a potential diagnosis......So yes, medication is definitely an option when we get there. Pear tree - thank you for sharing your experience. It helps to feel we are not alone with our situations and to know others have been through so much. I don't know much about therapeutic communities....I am glad that you were able to access that for Blossom even though it must be heartbreaking that that had to happen. At the moment we are hoping the therapy at Integrate Families (when we get it) will make a difference and also the potential medication - but we know it's going to be a long hard road. I think I will take from this that one to one time for each of the children and separating them as much as possible is the way forward at the moment. It makes me sad as it isn't the family life I envisaged, but then it isn't for any of us I suppose....

I have 3 Ac then a younger bc. I was lucky he never copied the behaviour especially those dd and ds1.He is much more aware and kind to those who have additional needs and will support and offer help when he can, However he missed out on a lot and I don't know how he has managed to be such a well rounded adult working in the industry he wanted to be in since he was 4.But I made sure he had time by himself and hobbies the others were not allowed to gate crash. He also had a tv and x box in is room from age of 11 (the other never did) as I wanted him to be able to watch tv and pal games in peace .But I could trust him to be sensible with them.

Hi Rutiha, Coming to this really late sorry. I have two bs's and one ad - ad is the middle child. My ad has adhd, odd, dyslexia, dyspraxia and asd. Her behaviour is very challenging at times (in fact most of the time), and it affects my younger bs more than my eldest bs. My ad will not leave my bs alone and what i have found that helps are: closely supervise and if necessary separate. different schools - they were initially in the same school but my ad would not leave my bs alone in the playground as she found friendships difficult. Also her behaviour at school was very challenging and i was worried that the teachers would expect the same from my bs and it would affect his relationships with them. different holiday activities - my bs's school has a holiday camp and although she could go to it i will not let her. I feel that it has to be his and it allows him time away from her. She has a separate holiday activity - she goes pony riding at the weekend and her stables runs holiday camps which she goes to (and loves). On the days that she goes i spend time with by bs - either take him out or arrange play dates for him. I still have a baby monitor in my bs's room (not that he needs it) but my ad has a habit of going into his room at bedtime and either hiding under his bed or behind the door. One evening i found her lying on top of his bed reading one of his books - my bs was asleep! if she goes into his room i can hear her over the monitor and go and fish her out. It is exhausting having to parent this way so i really do understand. best wishesxx

Thank you for your comments. Yes, we just try and separate most of the time. It makes family life very difficult. We have heard that it is going to take a year to get a potential ADHD diagnosis from CAMHS because of their workload...and we are still waiting for the therapy through ASF. Took AS into school today and he refused to get out of the car. Went to get the headteacher and he went in straight away for her...I hate the feeling that school probably think we are just inadequate parents...does anyone else ever feel like that? But they don't see what we battle day in and day out at home....

Please don't think that you are inadequate because you are not. School no doubt also see his behaviour and so they know that you are doing the best in very difficult circumstances. when i have ever had any problems with teachers not understanding (usually PE teachers for some reason) I put my best "don't argue with me" face on and put them straight. I no longer take any crap from schools but it takes a long time to get to the right place in your own head to be able to do that, if you know what i mean. You also have to learn to grow a thick skin and not care what people think and also be prepared to tell teachers exactly what you are dealing with at home even if it makes you feel like you are "throwing your child under the bus" so to speak. You should also make sure that your bs's school/nursery are also under no illusion as to what you and your bs are dealing with from your as. In fact my bs is now also registered as a "young carer" and gets help from that organisation - my eldest bs wasn't interested in doing this due to his age (he is nearly 18). If you are able to, consider paying privately for a adhd dx so that you can access the meds quicker. This will take a lot of pressure off your home life. We did this and still pay privately to see my ad's adhd doctor but the meds are prescribed by our gp and so are paid for by the nhs. Have you applied for DLA for your as? you do not need dx's to do this and if you qualify then you will also get carers allowance - could use this to fund the adhd doctor or other things. also look at applying for EHCP - you can do this yourself (we did) or school can do it. Once we had our ad's adhd under control we then found lots of other things which the adhd was masking - dyslexia, dyspraxia and asd, so also consider assessments from ed psychologist/SaLT etc. I know exactly what you are dealing with and it truly is soul destroying. I wish i could say it gets better, but from my experience it doesn't. xxx

one other thing - if he does have adhd you really need to get this under control as until it is he will not be able to access the therapy - he just will not be able to concentrate for it to make any difference. So go and see your GP again and tell him to write to cahms and ask for the assessment to be expedited so that your as can properly access this other therapy. xx

Thank you for your help. Will reply more in full tomorrow...but just a quick question. We had thought of getting him assessed privately for ADHD...but wasn't sure where to do that. Where did you go?

There are many organisations that do that - we went through Clinical Partners - were given an appointment for a full assessment within a week - they operate in different parts of the country and see children as well as adults (my daughter was an adult by this time) - just google private assessment for ADHD

In my experience it is good for school to see some of the issues. A couple of times in Infant school TAs came a couple of blocks to get AS1 when he went into meltdown mode on the way to school. AS2 still loses it sometimes in the morning too and his best buddy the school nurse comes and gets him. 98% of the time they are fine and they always are fine once there. You've got to remember they've probably seen it before...and you are getting them there. We knew someone who did her teacher training in a bad area and the children cried when it was time to go home. They also had a washer and dryer at school so they could wash the kids clothes. You aren't in that league. Chin up! And go for the private ADHD assessment...it makes a big difference. BdF

In my experience it is good for school to see some of the issues. A couple of times in Infant school TAs came a couple of blocks to get AS1 when he went into meltdown mode on the way to school. AS2 still loses it sometimes in the morning too and his best buddy the school nurse comes and gets him. 98% of the time they are fine and they always are fine once there. You've got to remember they've probably seen it before...and you are getting them there. We knew someone who did her teacher training in a bad area and the children cried when it was time to go home. They also had a washer and dryer at school so they could wash the kids clothes. You aren't in that league. Chin up! And go for the private ADHD assessment...it makes a big difference. BdF

Hi Rutinha, We had our ad assessed through an organisation called LANC - learning assessment and neurocare centre they have an office in london and other parts of the country. they specialise in children and we have found them to be fab. they also assess for other conditions as well if need be - google them. xx

Thank you all for your recommendations. .we will Google them and get information. So councils accept the results of private assesments as well as those done through CAMHS eg. For applying for EHCP's? I presume they must do?

Mine did - the psychiatrist who did the assessment works full time for the NHS and privately Saturday mornings and sometimes in the evening - ADHD is one of his areas of expertise

I would double check with your LA. Our LA said that they would not accept a private dx for ASD and so we had to go through the comm paed which took a couple of months (our GP asked for it to be expedited as our AD was about to transfer to senior school). However, they were more than happy to accept a private dx for adhd/odd/dyslexia/dyspraxia - which seems a bit strange. My ad's adhd doctor is also a psychiatrist who works with cahms. But it is more important that you have access to the meds quickly to improve your home life so get a private dx and get the meds and if the LA wont accept a private dx then also stay on the waiting list for cahms. xx

One way round is is to use a specialist that is well respected by their own team. But even then it can be a fight.

Thank you for all your advice. We would be lost without it! We had a hard day today - I didn't help because I am finding that I am more reactive and dysregulated myself - not being consistent - just all over the place because I am so worn out by AS's need to be constantly in control. We are going to phone private psychiatrists after the bank holiday. Thank you for the heads up re the LA. We will check. We also thought that we would stay on the process for CAHMS as they said it would be a year, so we may as well stay on it even if we get a private diagnosis. I have one question. I realise that hyperactivity, dislike of change, meltdowns, lack of ability to concentrate can all be related to trauma. We have finally been allocated a therapist to work with him on the trauma. If we go to get an ADHD/ASD assessment how will they be able to tell what is trauma related and what is ADHD/ASD? I am sure that they are intertwined, but can the psychiatrists distinguish that when they are making a diagnosis? We have a change of teacher at school coming up - for the last half term of the year!!!! School reckon he is dealing fine with it - but we don't . Today he expressed that he hated change at school. We have told them what we think he needs at school so many times, but I don't think they have the resources to provide it. We just need the report from the therapists and the potential ADHD diagnosis to get on the long journey of potentially applying for and EHCP.... Thank you all for taking the time to read and reply. Really appreciated xx